31 day retrograde calendar - Ref 47245 in white gold

Hi Guys,

I am just about to pull the trigger on the 31 day retrograde calendar - Ref 47245 in white gold, but am not sure about what the packaging should look like. I've seen the papers and have found them to be legit. The seller is offering a leather pouch as the one below, instead of the wooden box and diary which I've seen from other sellers. Some online sellers however, are also selling the watch with only the leather pouch.

What is packaging that I should be expecting? Or are they both original? Will the resale value be affected by the lack of a wooden box? Any thoughts input would be helpful. Thanks.


31 day retrograde calendar - Ref 47245 in white gold31 day retrograde calendar - Ref 47245 in white gold
I'll check but overall I would think that
05/20/2013 - 12:32
having the wooden box is a plus
Hi J, welcome to THL
05/20/2013 - 14:17
My RG version of this watch came in a nice wooden box, with rosewood trim, not the wood box you show. I didnot get a leather pouch with mine. It is a great watch, I'm sure you'll enjoy it! Best Regards, Dan
Thanks very much Alex and Dan..
05/20/2013 - 17:14
I really appreciate the insight and kindness in response to my query, and must thank you both for your effort in previous posts about Ref 47245 which I found very helpful.  Specifically, Dan's question about the quantity of Ref 47245 produced over the years (excluding the LE "47247") piqued my interest. It led me to a hunt, and I've noticed that examples of the white dial were produced only in WG and RG, and examples of the black dial produced only in platinum. The production quantity of each example remains unanswered though. Auction activity seems to suggest that these three examples were made in equal numbers, and that Ref 47245 was made available in either the wooden box or leather pouch, but not both. Resale value seemed to be determined by condition (obviously) and the availability of certificate of origin, but not packaging. As such, I'm not dissuaded by the watch (mint with papers!) bundled with the leather pouch as the model has since been discountinued, although I would very much prefer a wooden box. Maybe the next hunt will be to find myself an accurate wooden box which came along with the WG version. Another big question mark is whether Ref 47245 belongs to the Patrimony collection (I would think), or the Malte collection. It is listed by most dealers on the web as a Patrimony model, but an authority such as Antiquorum references it as a Malte model. What is it really? Thanks - J
When I purchased a BNIB 47245 from an AD in 2004
05/20/2013 - 18:50
it came with the leather wallet and outer cardboard box. That wallet is the most useful "box" you'll ever have, as it will store 4 strap watches easily, and is great for travel. Bill
Bill bought his BNIB 47245 from an AD earlier than mine
05/21/2013 - 00:26
So its obvious that VC changed the packaigng over time. I agree with Bill, the leather pouch is much more practical, in fact I've bought several of them for various storage and travel needs over time. I've learned over time tat VC will never really list production volumes for specific watches, unless they are limted editions. Whether it's officially part of the Patrimony or Malte line is an interesting question. I've also seen it listed by others as a "Patrimony", but I believe the lugs look more like they were from the Malte of that time period. I don't recall seeing VC officially classifying it as part of one line or the other. Maybe we have to go to our source of all things official? (Aka, Alex?) Sorry about the appearance of an unstructured post, I do not know hw to create line breaks when posting from an iPad. While writing, the line breaks appear, but the final post removes all of them.
After some investigation running through various examples..
05/21/2013 - 11:00
I've come to the conclusion that for the packaging of Ref 47245 (with the exception of the LE "47247" which always comes with a fitted wooden box) there is no discernible pattern of earlier models receiving the leather pouch, and later models the wooden box. My guess is that it depends on the AD rather than the serial number / purchase date / material of the watch. The confusion over whether Ref 47245 belongs to the Patrimony or Malte collection stems most likely from the fact that today, the Patrimony range today features round shapes, while the Malte models are tonneau inspired. However, as Dan rightly points out, the Malte collection is distinguished by its distinctive stepped lugs which does not ever feature in the Partimony range. Thanks. Cheers, J