6038 or 6405 (need your advice)

Dear All,

I've been surfing the web for months, and came to the conclusion, that there's no other place like this forum for another prestige swiss watch brand. Honest and often very-very patient communication is absolutely non-existent anywhere else, Chapeau!!

Of course, this is also the reason I came up the following question here: 

I realised eralier, that entering the world of VC could be easier, than people might think, due to the wide variety of vintage timepieces, supported with the famously excellent restoration service of the Brand, and this forum, naturally. I've found two good looking examples a 6038 automatic from the fifthys, with cal 1019, and  the serious looking,  6405, with coin bezel and cal 1001. Both looks fine, my only concern is, wether these timepieces are durable enough for regulrar daily wear, as none of them uses shock protection, to my best knowledge. 

I would also appreciate your advice, if there's any other model, I should look for, instead of thees. 

Thank you!



Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 12:28

Hi Csaba,

the blandness of your words remind me of another Csaba, very gentle and competent watch fan I know.

I just wanted to point out - to my knowledge - the calibres (and so, surely some models belonging to these references) you've mentioned do have anti-shock protection, respectively the Kif Securit for cal. 1019 and the more known Kif Flector for cal 1001.

My opinion counts nothing but I would go for a calibre K 1072/1, maybe a little more expensive but equally easy to find (more or less). If I had to choose between these two, you've posted - just for my personal taste and no further reasons - I would go for the manual.

Good luck :-)

Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 14:19

Hi Flyrobyfly, 

I'm affraid, that your kind description does not totally fit me, but I assure you that your opinion counts, I'll check does options with K1072/1!

Your answer just justifies again, how fantastic forum this is,

Thank you for that!



Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 14:38


Just a brief comment about movements.

Both watches you show are very nice.

The 2 VC movements that have been real "workhorses" are the 453 and the 1120.

Several models are available with each movement. They are both very robust for daily wear.

The 1120 would be my preference but it is more expensive but is a beautifully made reference.

Just my 2 cents.


Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 16:17

Hello Joseph,

I'm very thankfull for your advice, I also met somewhere opinions preferring the 1120 movement, I'l look around to find something.

Thank you again,


A list of the vintage V&C calibers can be found
07/07/2014 - 16:21
Re: A list of the vintage V&C calibers can be found
07/07/2014 - 19:58

THANK YOU Tick-talk, I've been looking for something similar, but I couldn't imagine someone has a list, such comprehensive, than yours!

Thank you again, amazing!Csaba

Hello de Owar, the problem with VC...
07/07/2014 - 16:24

Is there are too many beautiful vintage watches to choose from! heart


Out of the two you have shown us, I personally prefer the Ref. 6405.  It is thin and I personally think cal 1001 is one of VC's best calibres.  It has the classic 5 bridge design that you rarely see in modern movements, it has the Geneva Seal, and it migth have an interesting Gyromax, free-sprung, balance (if it is the cal 1001/2 version of the movement).  I recently had a watch with this movement restored by VC and my wife has been wearing it continously for almost 3 months.  Depending on how active you are and how wet you get...a watch with cal 1001 that has been recently serviced should be as good as any vintage watch used for daily wear.

Cal 1001/2:

Hello de Owar, the problem with VC...


If you prefer automatics, the cal 1019 is good...but I think the cal 1072 is a more refined version (it is based on cal 1019 if I am not mistaken)...or the cal 1120 ultra-thin as other members have already mentioned.  Also, as Flyboyfly has already mentioned...these movements all have anti-shock protection.  (in the picture of cal 1001 above, you can see the shock protection on the balance wheel's cap jewel is shaped like a Maltese Cross! yes)

Welome to THL and let us know what you finally choose!

Best Regards, Dan


Re: Hello de Owar, the problem with VC...
07/07/2014 - 20:03

Dear Dan,

Thank you for your help, I was sure people here will be very competent, but your comment absolutely exceeds what I was expecting, :-)

I'm also attrected by the K1001 movement, even if I've never had any experience with a thin vintage movement, and not even with a vintage watch. So your help is invaluable, thanks for that!



Why not both?
07/07/2014 - 19:42

Two great watches. The 6405 is quite thin, the automatic is noticeably thicker. Make sure the coin edge finish on the bezel of the 6405 is in great condition as that might be impossible for even the service department to restore to new condition.

Good luck with your decision.



Re: Why not both?
07/07/2014 - 20:07

You are right Bill, why not?

I also had concerns with the coin bezel, I will ask for macros. Thank you for your advice! 


Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 20:25

Hi Csaba.

To "confuse" you little more, please take a look on this:


This is a watch I got just recently and I jump of  happyness every day.  Watch is not waterproof so every hand washing you have to take it off (or any similar). Take care.



Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 20:31

Sorry for the wrong link, this is the right one:


http://people.timezone.com/library/horo ... 0396906210



Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 20:41

Beautiful, the K1120 movement, Joseph has adviced!

You are right, there are lots of different great variations of cases, dial designs, movements. Yours might come from the seventies, probably, don't you know its reference No?

Thank you for sharing!


PS: When washing my hands, I always take off my panerais as well, never believe Italians! ;-) Kidding, love them all, and I know, they are swiss made for a long time, just their origin...

Re: Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 20:49

" never believe Italians! ;-) "    Good one.


This is ref: 7401

Re: Re: Re: Re: 6038 or 6405 (need your advice)
07/07/2014 - 21:35

Thank you,

very elegant, something like the predecessor of the Patrimony line. 

Really nothing to be added to what has been said other than
07/07/2014 - 21:22

Wishing you a hearty welcome

Re: Really nothing to be added to what has been said other than
07/07/2014 - 21:38

Thank you Sir,

And thank you All!

great pleasure to be part of this.