Continuation of manual winding protection

Hi All,

I am wondering if VC has some sort of built in stop or protection mech that helps prevent the braking of the main spring in their current manual winding calibers?



04/30/2008 - 02:49
04/30/2008 - 09:19
04/30/2008 - 15:10
04/30/2008 - 18:02
I don't think so
04/30/2008 - 02:49

I might be completely wrong.

But when the guy sold me the 47212 at the Boutique, he freaked me out a little bit, because he was telling me how I should avoid winding the watch manually, that it is much safer to use the mechanism that is integrated in the box...

And he said when doing it manually, I should try to wind it using the side instead of grabbing the crown with my fingers.

The first morning, I was quite afraid to wind it up

When I spoke to Mr Bernaz, he said that it was fine using both fingers, but not to do it too hard...

All that to say that based on what I've been told, there is a risk of breaking something if the crown is turned too hard...

But I'll let the experts confirm

use the mechanism that is integrated in the box...
04/30/2008 - 04:08

Hi Veillotron,

Could you explain what you meant by "use the mechanism that is integrated in the box..."?  I think that I understand what you meant by using the side.  I believe you are saying push your finger or thumb against the maltese cross on the crown and turn it this way; is this what you meant?



Re: use the mechanism that is integrated in the box...
04/30/2008 - 12:37


Sorry for not being clear... The 47212 came with an automatic winder, that was integrated in the presentation box that came with the watch. SInce it is a perpetual calendar and it can be a pain to readjust, VC decided to include as part of the package the automatic winder so that if you decided not to wear the watch for a few weeks, it still would be up to date by the time you took it out of the box...

In terms of "using the side of my finger", yes, you understood correctly want I meant.

Some pics later today!
04/30/2008 - 09:19

Have to rush now


Nope! The only manual watch I have seen with this feature is the new
04/30/2008 - 11:39

Urwerks where you can keep winding but the crown will never block meaning that once the mainspring is fully wound the winding mechanism disengages and the crown continues turning but no longer winding. The reason for this Felix Baumgartner explained is that since the crown is so big a lot of force goes into the winding and those who were not cautious enough could end up breaking the spring.

With the VC manual winds like almost 99% of other manual winds you just have to slow down winding when you feel the crown "resisting" more and more on each turn.

How do you wind your Patrimony, Alex?
04/30/2008 - 15:45

I do it till the crown's the same feeling with Panerai, Malte chrono, etc. Should I turn it anticlockwise after it's fully wound or I just wind the watch without having to reach a fully wound state? Thanks!

I wind all my manual wind watches slowly and with great care as soon
04/30/2008 - 16:12

as I feel the crown resisting but I do full until the crown no longer moves. I then give a small turn backwards to release the exrtra tension.

So, wind after it's full then wind backwards, say, 1 turn?
04/30/2008 - 18:54

Is that ok?

Yes (nt)
04/30/2008 - 20:44


Last ? on this
05/01/2008 - 02:20

Hi Alex,

Do you know if the 1141 caliber has the winding protection system that Doc has shown in his pictures?



this protection system is used in all manual winds maybe with small
05/01/2008 - 11:35

differences but the end result is the same.

Thanks Alex (nt)
05/01/2008 - 06:20


Ok, this is the manual winding mechanism.
04/30/2008 - 14:14

This is what you see, stay there, don't start to take it apart just to check that I'm right

Sorry it's a Zenith, but these are the only pics that I found that illustrate this question.

BTW, from the German magazine Armbanduhren, which is the oustanding best watch magazine,

when it comes to general knowledge and technical information, not only looking at the latest only!

You see the finger on the little wheel and when it comes in action, it lockes the big wheel,

which is on the mainspring barrel that contains the mainspring and below you even see the lid.

This a mainspring.

It's attached to this specially designed arbor, in the centre of the barrel.

Which of course in one end bears the big wheel.

If you lift the barrel away you see what controls the stop device under the barrel, a spring.

If you don' get it now, you are lost cases ,

and just be glad that it actually works, and enjoy your watches



thanks Doc for the illustrated explanation... (nt)
04/30/2008 - 14:25


Thanks Doc, pictures worth a thousand words nt
04/30/2008 - 17:36


Good question KCC.
04/30/2008 - 15:10


As far as I know, there is no special system to prevent except a spring, like in (almost) all manual winding watches.

I wind my watch as stated by Alex till the crown is blocked. Then, I turn the crown back 2-3 times to help release the spring.

I never got a problem by doing like this (and advised by a watchmaker, moreover).


Seems I have to post again!!
04/30/2008 - 18:02

You can never, nearly overwind a moden wrist watch, that goes even for vintage from 30's and forward !!

You can of course, but than you must really want to !

By normal winding, just wind until it stops, you don't, sorry Alex, have to be extra careful at the end.

That's just old fairy tales.

If you look at my post above you understand.

When it's stop it's really stop. And to break the "finger" you need an enormous amount of power!

Mainsprings sometimes rupture because of age or material defects,

but that is seldom.

Sometimes it can be that a watch that has been unwinded for a long, long time,

many months or years, the tension in the spring has become exhausted.

That's the only time to be careful, the first times just wound it half way, or so,

if it rupure it does.

I have two watches that I have to change mainspring on for the time being.

One from the 40's and one from the 90's.

Both ruptured suddenly, and not after lying unused for a long time.

I had a one year old watch, that the mainspring broke on, because of some material defect,

no it was NOT the DTR , and it was changed on guarantee.

So once and for all, just wind until it stops.

You'll never break the mainspring by wounding to much,

if you are not Rambo or use a tool



Crystal clear Doc! Very direct...
05/01/2008 - 14:06

So no need to turn it backward after it's full? I didn't know that since I nromally wound my watch till it stopped.

thanks Doc! These words are
05/02/2008 - 03:41
Very reassuring to hear :-)
There was a note in my VC Grande Classique box that said.....
04/30/2008 - 20:37

.....turn back 3 revolutions after fully winding, or words to that effect.  This model, I believe, was the 1st VC watch with the in-house Calibre 1400.


Re: There was a note in my VC Grande Classique box that said.....
04/30/2008 - 21:35

I have seen it written that the reason for turn the crown a bit in the reverse diretion after winding it fully was to prevent "overbanking". This refers to unlocking the escape wheel and causing a dysynchrony between it and the escapement lever.

The watch will stop.

I don't understand the relationship completely but one of the causes can be a broken or bent winding stem. (Don't ask me how it causes this problem. Its certainly not obvious to me!)


The explanation I have heard,
05/01/2008 - 02:46

because it's the same text in the manual to the DTR,

is for the water protection!


Anyhow nothing to do with the wounding of the barrel


that's very strange!! I was speaking with Philippe Dufour once who
05/01/2008 - 11:40

advised the back winding on the crown (just half a turn no need to turn 3 times) as to release the superfluous tension.

That man is hard to oppose,
05/01/2008 - 13:02

but from all knowing persons I asked and from all articles I read,

the message is the same.

When it's stop, it's stop, and as you can see for your self,

you can't back the barrel since it's locked by the "finger".

The only explanation to PD's advice,

would be that he meant that not wound up it full....



Sounds like my wife's behavior sometimes around the house.....
05/01/2008 - 17:13

....."Superfluous tension"!!!


Re: that's very strange!! I was speaking with Philippe Dufour once who
05/01/2008 - 18:33

I agree Alex.

There is an interview with him somewhere on the Web. I can't remember where I saw it but he mentions just that.

I have also heard the same from people at Lange.

I think turning the crown back slightly, as you say, takes any excess tension off the stem and prevents any defomation over the long termwhich can lead to the overbanking problem.

The ideal situation of course is to have a RDM (reserve de marche) indicator which indicates the power. You can thus wind it just short of the maximum.



Re: that's very strange!! I was speaking with Philippe Dufour once who
05/02/2008 - 12:10

i think that there is to opinions for this theme like mr Doc says and  and also mr Alex and others and i believe that both of them are correctly right   

personaly i have a pam00183 bs [URL=][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

and i used to to make back the crown when the winding stop.probably it is an exaggeration to do this bat with this way i think that i have my head in peace as they said in my country  (peace of mind)