Continuing the post "Doesn't anyone like Patek anymore?"

below, I would like to know from those who know: In Japan & Italy, which one between PP & VC is more popular? I recently visited a Patek AD in HK and the sakles said Patek is the most popular brand in HK and the rest of the world. Maybe because the AD was holding a Patek exhibition there Continuing the post "Doesn't anyone like Patek anymore?"...

In Singapore, I think judging from some enthusiasts there, VC may be gaining more & more fans recently. But still, Patek is regarded the King. Any thoughts? Thanks! 

in Italy Patek still has the mystique of n°1, in France VC is
06/24/2007 - 11:18

is still considered very prestegious and I think I read somewhere that in mainland China VC was the favorite brand of those having an income at a certain (high) level.

Re: in Italy Patek still has the mystique of n°1, in France VC is
06/25/2007 - 17:53

40 YRS AGO I DID A FAVOR CARRYING SOMETHING IMPORANT FROM MANILA TO HK FOR A RELATION.   IN RETURN THE RELATION (CHINA MAN) REWARDED ME BY PULLING FROM HIS BRIEF CASE A CHOICE OF A YELLOW OR WHITE SIMPLE ROUND AND THIN VC MECHANICAL WATCH WITH CROC STRAP AS AN EXCHANGE FOR MY PACKAGE.  I CHOSE THE YELLOW BECAUSE I THOUGHT THE WHITE ONE WAS EITHER STEEL OR ALUM AND NEVER IN MY IMAGINATION GOLD.  I WAS NOT IMPRESSED WITH VC.

I WAS YOUNG PEACE CORPS VOLUNTEER RETURNING TO THE STATES AFTER 2 YEAR TOUR.  WHAT WOULD I KNOW OF WATCHES?  AT THAT TIME THE WATCHES OF CHOICE WERE TIMEX AND SEIKO QUARTZ WHICH WERE NEAT, NEW AND RAN ON BATTERY POWER.

THE POINT OF THIS IS THAT THE INDIVIDUAL COULD HAVE REWARDED ME WITH ANY WATCH AVAILABLE IN HK BUT HE CHOOSE VC AS AN OFFERING AND HE CLEARLY EXPECTED ME TO KNOW THAT IT WAS THE BEST.  PRC INCLUDES HK AND I IMAGINE THE VC FEELING CONTINUES TODAY. 

That's a nice gift! :-) Do you still have the watch? (nt)
06/26/2007 - 12:26

e

Excellent post Rei! A call to the Loungers, how is VC perceived in
06/24/2007 - 14:44

your country?

Hi Alex, in Indonesia where I live
06/24/2007 - 16:46

not many know watches...Most of the population has less to eat, so they have never heard of Patek or Vacheron or AP.

But those who do know a bit of watches, mostly it's Rolex/Tag/Omega and now, a lot of Panerai & AP (only for rich boys) . Those who really in the know, love & buy watches, I guess it's more of Patek (they buy from Singapore ost of the time). My friend whose dad was in the watch business a long time ago knows Vacheron but never heard of Patek or AP

But really, the watch community in Indonesia is not as alive as it is in our neighbours: Singapore, Thailand & Malaysia.

Re: Excellent post Rei! A call to the Loungers, how is VC perceived in
06/28/2007 - 06:05

Hi! In Manila Rolex is still leading. When you go to gatherings like wedding, birthday parties majority of the guests are all wearing Rolex. There are a few who wear AP, IWC and JLC. PP and VC are famous among the country's elite (super rich). For VC in particular, the distributor here in Manila have very few models available and its display area or counter is not as impressive as the distributor for PP.

Re: Continuing the post "Doesn't anyone like Patek anymore?"
06/24/2007 - 16:24

Based on my personal feeling and opinion, PP is still the most highly-regarded brand in Japan (but not untouchable to VC in some senses). VC is really coming close in practice. I am waiting for the day people here well perceive the way PP is somehow marketing its watches for being no.1 and then may turn their face to VC more and more.

Regards,

Joe

i believe that PP is still no.1 in Hong Kong. However, i have.........
06/24/2007 - 16:43

a few business associates from China with VCs, so i have a feeling that VC is more appreciated in China. just my personal observation.

It's true like what Tourbillon said as well>
06/24/2007 - 16:54

that VC is #1 in China. I read that in Purists.com if not mistaken. Interesting! I too would like to see VC getting more recognition.

From my past personal experience, VC is more popular in China.
06/24/2007 - 18:50

But may be the trend has now changed.  I just got back from Hong Kong yesterday.  During my stay there, I had visited some retailers.  Their main customers now are those from China.  The retailers are happier to see them as they seldom bargain.  From what I had noticed in most of the retailer, PP left with very few modals in the display window whereas VC has more stocks.  A senior staff told me that Chinese from mainland China are chasing for PP.  They have recognised and accepted PP as a prestigious brand despite the fact that they still haven't forgotten about VC.   VC's advantage is that it has penetrated China market longer than PP.

Now, i think if PP or VC wants to be No.1, it depends on what the majority of the mainland Chinese say.   Like it or not, I have seen their force of purchasing.  It is certainly not a good news to us being collectors.

Regards

Ling

Yes, if all those Chinese buy PP
06/24/2007 - 19:57

it'll surely jack up the prices! Take a look at the numbers  (of China's population).

Do you know which Patek they buy? Simple or complicated ones? I know a lot of people in HK wear Patek. Aquanauts, calatravas are plenty. Hm...maybe I should get one as well

Chinese purchasing power...
06/25/2007 - 03:07

The words of my AD echo the words of Ling.

In the past years, the Japanese market has been very lucrative (still is) but of course the population is not too large.  However, with the recent upswing in the Chinese economy, we find a burgeoning "new rich" class in China.  The buyers from my AD expressed that the increasing Chinese presence at Baselworld in the last few years has now overtook that of Japan.  The Chinese buyers were really aggressive and placing large orders making it very tough to compete for stocks. 

VC, as with Bovet, has had a significant historical presence in China but I do not think it is enough to stop the PP marketing machine.  China's new rich are looking for watches that evoke luxury, power and status (probably without knowing much about history, etc), and this is exactly the type of market where marketing-intensive brands like PP and Rolex excel (of course, everyone is trying to get a piece of the pie). 

Although I would love to see VC on top in China.  Personally, I would be happy if they took only Pateks and leave all the VCs for me.

LOL! (nt)
06/25/2007 - 05:58

.

Re: Continuing the post "Doesn't anyone like Patek anymore?"
06/24/2007 - 18:00

As Joe mentioned, PP is No. 1 here in Japan.  It is a very competitive market with most brands being very well represented (just look at the number of VC ADs in Japan!).  Here too, PP's massive marketing machine is in full steam with PP ads visible in magazines, posters, and even in newspapers!  Of course, this does not mean that PP is just advertising.  It just goes to show how far a great watch, coupled with superb marketing can go.

What celebrities wear really influences the popularity of brands too.  Frank Muller, Roger Dubuis, Bvlgari, Cartier, and of course the staple Rolex are also popular with the less horologically knowledgeable, or designer brand concious rich.

VC also has its following, as evidenced by Japan LE's being released every year.  But it seems that we are a more quiet group.  I really do not bump into many fellow VC fans here and I believe VC appeals to an older audience on average. 

I am sure Breguet and AP and Lange are also doing well here.  I really should ask my AD about the sales rankings here.

Thanks for the interesting post Rei. 

Hi Kazumi,
06/24/2007 - 18:46

based on many polls done by magazine like Tokei Begin, it seems that top 5 always include IWC, Breitling, Rolex, Omega & Panerai. AP used to be less popular than it is now (particularly because of the extreme popularity of ROOs). 

But no matter what, I guess PP is still the king of horology. I have gone through all PP models many many times, I still can't find the one that is extraordinary with the exception of 2499. Their Nautilus models are not as well built as Royal Oak, IMHO.   

Hello, Rei.
06/24/2007 - 19:43

Yes, the brands you mentioned are regular contenders in magazine rankings.  I guess this is because they are more accessible to a larger population.  PP, VC, etc. are known only to a small poplulation and accessible to even fewer.

I am wondering how VC, AP, Breguet, Lange and other more exclusive brands are ranked.  I'll make sure to ask next time.

Fairly unknown here in Scandinavia to random people...
06/26/2007 - 01:04

Ofcourse watchlovers know VC for sure but that average dude in the streets dont have a clue. To bad though that we dont have any AD left here in Sweden, pretty hard to open peoples eyes when they are not around. But in this global world people still makes purchases over the borders so its no stress. Seen some Roger Dubuis, Frank Müllers, Langes for example at the auctionhouses here and they dont have any ADs here so...

Think PP is Nr. 1 in the top brands here aswell. Patek buyers is the same kind of guy that buys Rolex. They start with Rolex and if the cash-flow is getting better they finish with PP (becouse they dont know better).

VC seem to have China and Russia as their main targets at the moment. At least they seem to work hard to get new shares there with new boutiques, LE-realeses etc.

/Rgds

/lloyd

It's a warzone out there
06/26/2007 - 06:10

 All for a piece of a pie. Can't we all get along? LOL!

The smart move would have been not to all try to get a piece of the
06/26/2007 - 17:52

pie but rather try to enlarge the pie by educating the potential customer in the values of high end watchmaking. I guess with the existence of the the different internet sites this will be achieved...hopefully