Help With Vintage Vacheron

I have the opportunity to purchase a beautiful vintage Vacheron Constantin. I know its authentic and the dial has never been redone. My only concern is that there are marks on the dial by the hour markers. I can't figure out what caused them and the seller isn't sure. Could anyone help asap before the auction ends, thank you very much.

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Re: Help With Vintage Vacheron
10/17/2012 - 05:40
Hi, Are you refering to the little black circles at either end of the markers? If so, they they look like little gromets or holes to secure the ends of the markers. Probably the dial was perforated in these location. The markers would have little feet to insert into the holes and would thus be secured in place. (My speculation only) Welcome to the Lounge. Joseph
Re: Re: Help With Vintage Vacheron
10/17/2012 - 05:47
Does this greatly affect the value/desirability? Thanks.
10/17/2012 - 06:57
To me, it looks more like a reaction or oxidation on the dial from the markers.
Re: Oxidation?
10/17/2012 - 07:46
Would you guys feel comfortable buying a Vacheron with these imperfections? Does it greatly affect the value? What would you guys pay for a 1960's ultra slim VC with a cal. 1003? Thanks.
I can't figure out if it is oxydation on the dial or the holes for the
10/17/2012 - 11:25
markers, if the latter then the markers have been changed and the ones on the dial are thinner than the original ones as you're not supposed to see the holes
I would guess that the hour markers were replaced.
10/17/2012 - 12:19
Possibly with ones that are thinner than original. I say this because the black spots look too uniform around all the hour markers for me to think it is due to oxidation. If the markers were replaced, then that would affect the value - because most vintage collectors want all original parts. BR, Dan
Re: Help With Vintage Vacheron
10/17/2012 - 15:46
So, would you guys stay away? If not, what would you fell comfortable paying for it? Thanks.
for me the dial is extremely important as I look at my watch ...
10/17/2012 - 15:50
1000 times per hour cheeky I personally would stay away
Re: for me the dial is extremely important as I look at my watch ...
10/17/2012 - 15:56
A closer look
10/17/2012 - 18:21
I had a chance to look at the zoom pics on fleabay and what appears to have happened is that the original indexes were removed to clean and relacquer the dial.  This had the unfortunate effect of pulling the finish off the dial from underneath the indexes and around the locating holes where they were glued down.  The owner decided to reinstall the indexes on the dial as-is rather than refinish.  Wonder what the original condition was; if it was better left alone?  Anyway, the asking price is a good indicator that the seller knows there are problems blush.
10/17/2012 - 19:47
the index marker at 1 o'clock and 6 o'clock, the black "holes" are not visible (both, at 1 and the lower one at 6). In addition, there are numerous black spots under the 7, 8 and 2 o'clock markers. If the finish was damaged it was uneven. I suppose its possible that whoever did the job was sloppy, careless or amateurish. I was wondering if those spots were caused by a chemical reaction to whatever glue was used to secure the markers. The additial spots were just careless applications. The only way to  find out for sure is to have someone knowledgeable, (ie from VC) look at it. Very interesting! Joseph
Caps Lock stuck Joseph?
10/17/2012 - 20:24
LOL!  These discussions are a worthwhile assist for anyone thinking of getting into vintage but afraid of the pitfalls.  Those of us with experience handling these pieces can share our learning and hopefully save someone grief.  Sending a $2k timepiece to VC may be unrealistic for an owner or prospective purchaser, so for those people the "someone knowledgable" will probably be found on enthusiast forums like this one wink. FWIW, the uneven nature of the underlying flakes is what tipped the diagnosis for me, as that is exactly what I've seen when indexes are pulled off the face with tweezers and the glue takes a chunk of the finish along with it.  Agreed, whoever did the job was sloppy.
Re: Caps Lock stuck Joseph?
10/17/2012 - 21:23
No, Had them on then realized it then turned them off. Left the capitals for tthe header cooldevil I thought about the cost of sending the watch tto VC but didn't say anything. It would have been too upsetting surprise Too bad! Its a nice watch. Caveat emptor! Joseph
Re: Re: Caps Lock stuck Joseph?
10/17/2012 - 23:50
Yes it is too bad, I'll have to find another one. Thanks everyone.
Here is an example
10/19/2012 - 01:39
of a redial with some of the indexes removed so you can see the locating holes that Joseph mentioned.  Pins on the underside of the indexes fit into these holes.  You can also see traces of the old glue between the holes that was applied to the pins and bottom of the indexes.  Hard to hide a mistake with such fine tolerances!
Thanks Dean and of course Vacheron 1234
10/19/2012 - 02:23
This whole thread was very instructive! JB
Re: Help With Vintage Vacheron
10/19/2012 - 03:25
Nice try getting some support for this watch !