Vacheron Constantin Ref 47032

Good evening to all this amazing website!

First I want to congratulate with all of you and to apologize because I don't speak English well.

And now is time for my question: I already have one Vacheron Constantin Ref. 47247 Skeletonized Malte Retrograde Date Platinum and I like the style so I'm interested also to buy a  Ref 47032 Platinum retrograde perpetual calendar but I found just a few information about this model and his brother Ref 47031.

Mostly I'm interested to know how many pieces was made and if the mechanism of the perpetual calendar is in house or Vacheron bought it from another manifacture as the movement (I think who the caliber is a Jaeger Le Coultre, right?). Anyway all the informations (history, price list at launch, current estimate and also personal opinions) about this watch are welcome!

Thanks in advance

Vacheron Constantin  Ref 47032

Hi Luca, welcome to THL!
07/23/2015 - 03:11

Ref. 47031 and 47032 use cal. 1126 QPRD (Quantieme Perpetual Retrograde Date).  This movement is based on a JLC 889 ebauche.  JLC provides this ebauche as a kit.  Then VC finishes it and adds the components to make it a perpetual calendar and retrograde date.

I believe it was introduced in the early 2000s.  It's little brother, Ref. 47245, was first introduced in 2000 and the QP version came afterwards.

This watch has been discontinued for awhile, so it may be difficult to find a new, old, stock piece.  I've seem the come up at auction on occassion, but not very often.

I don't believe it was a limited edition, but I don't think many were produced.  VC will not provide that type of information unless it is an official limited edition.

Good luck hunting and post a picture of your 47247 when you can!  (Ref. 47247 is the open-worked version of the 47245 and came out in 2002.  The "245" was for the 245th Anniversary of the Brand in 2000.  The imited edition 47247 came out 2 years later, thus 2002, and is a limited edition).  Your 47247 uses the same base movement and is cal. 1126 R31.

Best Regards, Dan

Re: Hi Luca, welcome to THL!
07/23/2015 - 23:36

​​THANK YOU VERY MUCH Mr. Dan for your fast and detailed reply.

Do you think who also if I try to directly contact V.C. they will not give me the information about how many pieces they had made of the ref. 47032I know who is not a limited edition and I also think who just a few pieces was made but I no have idea how many (I guess less then 247 of my Ref. 47247)About the hunting, I already found one 47032 brand new: what price do you think is correct and do you think who this watch can be a good investment for the future; the alternatives are Ref. 47120 Dubail Edition or Ref. 47112P (unfortunately the 47212 is pretty impossible to find with human price). Can I have your personal opinion also about these models and a right price for buy on of them?Thanks in advanceLuca

 

Re: Re: Hi Luca, welcome to THL!
07/25/2015 - 07:17

Hi Luca,

VC will not provide detailed production information to anyone, so even if you ask, they will not tell.  They do not even give that information to Alex (our leader here and VC employee).

I'm glad you found a new Ref. 47032!  I am not good with remembering numbers, but a simple online check tells me that the original retail price was around US$105K.  You can check the Auction Houses for what they sell for on the secondary market.  This will give you an idea of how they are perceived today.

The three watches that you are comparing are quite different, so I find it very difficult to compare:

Ref. 47032 is a PC with Retrograde Date, open-dial.

Ref. 47120 is a Chronograph

Ref. 47112 is a PC Chronograph

Personally, if I already had a 47247, and money was not an issue...I'd go for the 47112P.  I love the moonphase on this watch.  It uses Cal 1141QP, which is based on Lemania's well known ebauche that has been one of the top chrono movement for decades.  The Ref. 47120 also uses Cal 1141, just no PC module.

Just like picking queues to line up in, I am terrible at picking "investment" watches.  It is like the stock market, many believe they can consistently pick winners year after year.  But these "experts" never, consistently, do better than picking stocks by throwing darts at the stock listing pages in the FT or WSJ.

It is almost impossible to predict what tastes will be like 10,20,...50 years later to know what pieces are better investments.  A couple of examples: 

Steel, vintage, versions of the top brands seem to be very popular and do well at auction, because they are rarer than their gold counterparts.  But when they were initially produced, it was because precious metals were restricted at that time...it wasn't a conscious effort to create a rare "investment" piece.

Original Rolex Daytonas are very sought after now, but when they were first sold...nobody wanted them, they were considered a market failure.  They were often the only Rolexes available at a discount in order to move them.  But because of this, their production quantities were lower...which leads to their desirability now.

So my best advice is to pick what makes you feel the most comfortable and happy.  If you can, try all 3 watches on and see if one seems to attract you more than the others.  If yes, that is the one that will give you the best return on your purchase,  because you will be more happy with it on and you will want to wear it more often.

BR, Dan

Re: Re: Re: Hi Luca, welcome to THL!
07/27/2015 - 01:20

It's a HONOR for me who you replied to me again dear Mr. Dan.

 

Is always a pleasure to read your comments. Your way of thinking about the watch market is detailed and absolutely true: for example in 1991 and in 1993 I bought a Reverso 60ème and a Reverso Tourbillon, two amazing pieces very hard to find at that time and no discount from the very expensive price list. In the same years for the same amount of money I could buy more than 11 Rolex Cosmograph Paul Newman!!! I think you can imagine how different is the value of my watches today, anyway I'm happy with my choice.

 

About the choice of my next watch I absolutely agree with you: my favorite is the Ref. 47112 but since now I not found a brand new one with a good price (I'm a bit maniac, I only collect brand new watches) maybe I will wait until I find it or if I'm lucky I will try to find his special brother, the Ref. 47212

 

Last question about the 47120 Dubail Edition: I know who many people don't like the mix with a classic case and movement and the modern sport design of the dial but I like it; anyway do you think who the price of this special model made in just 30 pieces must to be similar or just a bit more to the standard one or it has justified a price significantly more high? (Unfortunately I can't find the quotation of this model in some auction, maybe you can help me)

 

Thanks again.

 

Luca

All this talk of price and numbers
07/27/2015 - 22:53

reminds me of Oscar Wilde's only novel; The Picture of Dorian Gray.  A Faustian tale where the protagonist abandons his soul for eternal youth, it generated this famous quote; Nowadays people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Hi Luca, welcome to THL!
07/28/2015 - 07:01

The Dubail Edition was made by VC on the request of one of their long-term retailers, Dubail.  VC has done this for others as well, such as Pisa and for VC's own Boutiques around the world.  These usually involve just a change in dial and hands.  The case and movements are the same as the regular production pieces. 

I do not believe the prices of these Limited Editions are higher, but if they are, I would only pay it if I really liked that version more than the standard production pieces. That this dial/hands combo is "limited" isn't a factor for me.  If I like it, then I like it.  If I don't like it, being unique or limited is of no value to me.